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titansfaninva

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Back to Basics Dog Food
April 06, 2012, 12:36pm
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Alrighty then! I've been doing some research into the newer recipes of Back to Basics (they had a major change in their foods in 2009) dog foods. B2B is supposed to be designed as a like-nature-intended diet for alpha-dogs.

The tl;dr: The primary ingredient is organ meats, so it is very nutrient dense and high in protein, fat, and minerals. Things it does not have are: by-products, grains, or any fillers (including tomato pomace and potatoes!). It also supplements the food with peas (which may be reflected in the GA protein analysis, 38% O_O) as well as proteinated minerals. The process of proteination/chelation makes the minerals more absorptive, so they don't just pass through your dog's digestive system. In the absence of potatoes as a binding agent for the food, they have tapioca, which is not known to trigger food allergies in dogs.

I'm particularly interested in the pork formula for dogs that have been injured. Pork gelatin contains nutrients essential for rebuilding connective tissues, and with the formula's organ meats, it is has both a very high caloric value and a high palatability, making it appear to be an excellent choice for dogs that have become injured and stopped eating. Pretty exciting, actually! /tl;dr

Here's my standing issues with the food. The manufacturer and owner of B2B, Ainsworth Pet Nutrition, makes several other private label brands for companies like Wal-Mart, Kroger, and Wegmans. This isn't super-horrible, because the brand boasts and is known for its "Triple-Check" food safety standards, which is recognized by the SQF (Level 2) and the Global Food Safety Institute, which both exceed the international and domestic (U.S.) food safety guidelines. So this doesn't directly make them a bad source. HOWEVER: Even since they won their Food Safety Award in 2011, many reports/complaints have been filed over finding other dog foods mixed in with their B2B. These other foods contained food dyes and animal by-products, so it is suggestive that the foods are getting mixed together in trace amounts at the packaging stage of manufacturing. These complaints were still surfacing at the end of March 2012 and could be a major factor in customer loyalty if the brand can't remain consistent.

Another thing: The brand doesn't have any pre- or pro-biotics to aid in the digestion of the food. The brand actually boasts that there is no need for them and little research to suggest they actually do anything! I'm calling bullshit on that right now, but I don't know enough about the biochemistry to back that up with anything beyond personal bias of former belief. I'll see what I can find out.

(actually, all that might be tl;dr, too)


Here's what I mean to say. I'm going to be bringing this product into my store. I would like to know if any of you feed this product and what your opinions about and experiences with this food are. Did you turn down this food for another food choice, and if so, why?


I'm still kind of on the fence about this food - it doesn't have nearly as many fresh vegetables as I'm used to seeing on quality dog food - but I can see this as a sellable product in my pet food supply store. I'll post any personal customer experiences I can hear once I get the product, if you guys are interested.


Further reading:

Back To Basics Pet Food Homepage

DFA review of B2B

This food met Whole Dog Journal's List of Approved Foods in 2011. And obviously, it meets AAFCO's standards for pet nutrition, but that isn't saying much. :-p

Edited by: titansfaninva at April 06, 2012, 12:37pm

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Katie

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Back to Basics Dog Food April 06, 2012, 08:45pm
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tl;dr !!! na


blah blah blah

titansfaninva

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Alfie
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Back to Basics Dog Food April 07, 2012, 12:03am
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Y i hate it here!

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Katie

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Back to Basics Dog Food April 07, 2012, 06:57am
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lol <3


blah blah blah

scarletfang

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Back to Basics Dog Food April 10, 2012, 07:45pm
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Is the 38% protein a TOTAL protein by weight, or only of the dry matter? That sounds like too much protein for most dogs, and I would be concerned about the potential strain on the kidneys in filtering out the excess.

I'm sure I've made it known in the past that I am skeptical at best about a lot of the 'holistic' and 'natural' foods out there, but with the added concern of cross contamination between foods, I would be concerned about the potential for trace amounts of allergens. I would also be concerned that the nutritional analysis on the package was inaccurate.

I also find the idea of trying to imitate a 'wild-type' diet a little bit silly given how long an how thoroughly we've domesticated dogs. The dogs with whom most of us share our homes are a far cry from their wild hunter/scavenger ancestors, and their nutritional needs of adapted along the way.

This is a pretty good read on the basics of canine nutrition, from a VERY reputable source.


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titansfaninva

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Back to Basics Dog Food April 11, 2012, 11:28am
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I also find the idea of trying to imitate a 'wild-type' diet a little bit silly given how long an how thoroughly we've domesticated dogs.

I have to say I agree with you there. However, no matter how they advertise it, I can attest to seeing a very notable difference between dogs on Taste of the Wild / Blue Wilderness / etc. and Dog Chow / Hill's and the like. I see a remarkable change in energy level, improvement of coat, agility, stool, alertness, and longevity of that young-dog livelihood. So I'm a pretty big proponent of high-protein/dense foods over alternative commercial dry foods, (although I encourage owners to learn more so they can cook for their dog or choose raw diets instead/alongside.)

It's funny though, I'm pretty skeptical/cynical about the hot-words they use these days. I hate it when a customer comes in and asks me for "natural" or "holistic" foods and have no idea what the words actually mean. Because, frankly, I don't think there is any definition for what actually constitutes a "natural" product! More often than not, they just mean they want a food with no by-products and/or grains. Occasionally, it will be someone who wants organic food, but then they only want to spend grocery-store brand prices. "Natural" is just a word that sounds good to the buyer. Fucking consumerism, right? stare

Is the 38% protein a TOTAL protein by weight, or only of the dry matter? That sounds like too much protein for most dogs, and I would be concerned about the potential strain on the kidneys in filtering out the excess.

That's a concern that I always hold, actually. (and to answer your question: yes, it's the max protein composition after the product has been baked.) My knowledge only goes but so far when it comes to body processes, but I've come to the understanding that it has to do with the "quality" of the protein source and the state of the kidney in question. I read in the Whole Dog Journal, a pet products retail magazine, (and Dog Food Advisor, I think,) that so long as the kidney is otherwise healthy, higher proteins, to a fault, aren't damaging to a kidney when they are not achieved by the use of soy or by-products, which aren't nearly as digestible as muscle and organ meats. However, if the kidneys currently have problems, damages can be exacerbated. That's about as much as I can remember, but if you know some stuff, cue me in. ;-)

Top-notch dry food Orijen puts in 80% protein by weight (which is baked down to 38%) in its 80/20 Adult Dog Diet (Poultry/Fish/Egg).

I'd also like to note that brands that have such high proteins, especially grain-free foods, you're feeding less. Example, an active 50-lb dog on Orijen eats 2.5 cups vs. the same dog on Purina Dog Chow would eat 3-3.5 cups or more a day. I have many owners who use Orijen that feed less than the recommended amount and their dogs look phenomenal. With lower feeding amounts and increasing the number of times fed, would you think that the potential risk of kidney damage would be reduced?



Woo, words!


P.S.: Thanks for the link! I almost didn't see it. I'mma read it today.

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scarletfang

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Back to Basics Dog Food April 11, 2012, 05:53pm
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My concern with the kidneys is that subclinical kidney disease is one of the most common incidental findings that we see (ie a dog will come in for something totally unrelated, like a laceration repair, and the pre-anaesthetic bloodwork will show early stage renal disease). I'm not sure about your client base in particular, but most of the people that I deal with don't do bloodwork on their pets unless it's absolutely necessary, so a lot of animals are walking around with undiagnosed issues.

I'm much more comfortable recommending a high quality food in the 15% protein range (much closer to the actual requirements) to the general public for this reason.


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